SCAT Electronic News 22 November 1999
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SCAT Electronic News 22 November 1999
"SCAT - 40 Years of FAI Free Flight Competition"
Table of Contents
=================
Postal Gripe - Goodnow
RDT & 20-second attempt rule - Schlosberg
Rules - Bogie
Apollogies to Mike Bull - King
Life's little mysteries - Andresen
F1B flyoff performance _ Salzer
Postal Gripe
============
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I se that the World Champs are in the new NFFS issue. If every thing goes
right I should be getting the November issue about the first of December. So
much for the Post Office and their delivery system of third class mail.
Thermals
Brooks Goodnow
[Brooks - I'm glad to see that 'they' are pciking on
you know - used to think I was the last tpo get my NFFS
Digest]
RDT & 20-second attempt rule
============================
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The Danish CAIM rule change proposal (on the November 14th new letter)
supports RDT (Remotely activated DeThermalization) for F1A and F1B. (RDT is
already logal for F1C). Unfortunately, the Danish proposal also tries to
abolish the 20-second rule attempt since: "Maintaining the 20-second rule
attempt will give the users of RC-controlled dethermalization an
unreasonable advantage.
It is well accepted that the 20-second attempt rule could enable RDT fliers
a second attempt following a poor launch. Instead of abolishing the 20
second attempt rule, Ken Baur and I have proposed not to grant RADT fliers
a second attempt if their model was dethermalized under 20 seconds. The
proposal was submitted to all the member of the team selection program for
a vote and was approved by a large majority (an unusual feat, as most
American fliers disdain rule changes). Consequently, it will become an
official American proposal to the next CAIM meeting.
But abolishing the 20-second rule will have the opposite effect -
penalizing all the non-RDT fliers. The 20-second attempt rule was actually
dropped but later restores, as PeterTraub points out. Abolishing it again
would reintroduce zero-tolerance contests, were any mistake, however
insignificant, would spell doom. My guess is that a typical flier uses a
20-second attempt once or twice every flying season, since no one is
perfect. In addition I also believe that unreasonable rules create a
strong incentive to cheat.
The discussion of RDT eminated with a query of Ken Baur in this newsletter
a few months ago. The issue generated a considerable debate, resulting
with the present American proposal that addresses the 20-second attempt
issue. Other countries should defer to the American RDT proposal and not
dilute the issue with parallel proposals, however well intentioned.
Aram Schlosberg
Rules
=====
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FAI Rules for F1A, F1B, and F1C
The Southern California Aero Team has been in existence for 40 years.
I have been a member for the last 35 of those years. The major subject
of discussion at the club meetings has been on THE RULES.
Now then, we see interest in rules again in the club publication, SCAT ELECT-
RONIC NEWS. Comment on the subject is healthy and diverse. The good it
does is to bring to the readers views from many sources. Much discussion
is good in that it broadens the reader's thoughts on the subject.
Basically, the FAI rules are made for World Championships where the venues
are predominately suited to the rules. However, we have to use the same rules
for contest sites that are smaller, windier, wetter, snowier, more frigid
or blazingly hot.
One of the worst things to happen to a flyer is for his flights (any or all)
to be timed out of sight. Vladi Andriukov, in a good thermal was sucked into]
a cloud. Countless flights have gone out of sight (OOS). Really out of
sight of the timer. At the World Championships, the organizers provide timer
s from their country or from visitors from other countries. Thus the chance
of favoritism is diminished.
The Maven of Monrovia in California (Bob White) has developed a system for m-
inimizing OOS flights. His plan has been used in the February 14 Round cont-
est for several years. Simply, it is to fill a balloon with a light gas, lo-
ad the balloon with weight so that its rate of ascent approximates the
altitude of models flying. The balloon flight is made prior to the round
and is timed with the aid of binoculars. When it becomes difficult to see,
the clock is stopped and the time is then used as a basis for setting
the round time for the next flyoff flight.
If conditions permit, we might go back to the 5 minute round like we used to
do many years ago when we were not allowed to use binoculars. We only flew
five rounds then but I see no need to change from seven for the basic set.
For this we would not have to change any of the model specifications for so-
me time until the pressure of ingenuity caused the models to produce a large
percentage of competitors advancing to the flyoffs.
As for Vladi, I think his dad, Alex, could develop a gadget to measure visib-
ility, and when deminished, move the stab to keep out of clouds. The Jet Pr-
opulsion Laboratory (JPL) in Pasadena may well have the means for this system
and could be used if we allow electronics on board. However, if Vladi had
RDT, he could have DTed before going into the cloud, and surely
make the max.
Bill Bogart
Apollogies to Mike Bull
=======================
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I am sorry to say I made an unwitting mistake in attributing the rule change
suggestions to Mike Bull. I have now realised that the article in question
was by Trevor Grey, a friend of mine, as is Mike. Trevor Grey has flown some
very good, gadget equipped F1B models. I have a great respect or his serious
approach to FAI and Open models. However I still stand by my commentsand
the general thrust of my argument.
Regarding Anselmo Zeri's remarks on 25 gm F1B, I would say that, even
at that rubber weight it would be possible to still have a 'real' F1B model
(Still air times of maybe 3.5 to 4.0 min, in time), if the rest of the
rules remained the same. The problem, or Challenge, depending on your point
of view, is this would tend to drive us even more into the 'gadgets route'.
I would be fascinated with that approach and all that extra airframe weight
would be great for, enabling electronic timers, navigation systems etc etc.
to be sought after and developed. I fear that would never be allowed to
happen '-)))))
The overiding fact is that given any set of rules, the best modellers will
always end up beating the others !!!!
Peter King
Life's little mysteries
=======================
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Roger,
Welcome back.
As to the 20sec rule, it came from the 40sec rule of the early power days
(1930's) when a lot of ROG's hit a gust or grass or guests which aborted a
good flight. Someone decided that a model should fly at least as long
unpowered as it did under power. Think AMA still uses 40sec even though the
engine runs have been reduced dramatically. Also AMA is 6 attempts for 3
officials rather than 2 tries per flight.
FAI reduced to double the engine run until 10sec run.
I could never figure out, if one is trying to get a 3min max with a 6min
model, why anything short of 3min (or 2:59) should be counted as
official since something dramatic would have to happen for such a poor
showing. Why should a 2:59 or 0:21 be penalized but not a 0:19?
One of life's little mysteries.
H
F1B flyoff performance
======================
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The recent discussion about FAI model performance, especially F1B, results
mainly from the flyoff times.
At all contests, flying during ordinary weather conditions does _not_ give a
measurable advantage to a high performance (= buy-yourself high gadget)
model, but awards reliability and selecting the right moment to fly. Just
look at where some of the big names occasionally show up, if they just rely
on their 7-min-models!
Limiting rubber further than 30g, limiting gadgets etc will just make it
harder for a newcomer, even prevent him from competing!
So what to do with the flyoffs? The really huge flyoffs as seen in World
champs or contest with very unusual weather (like the holiday on ice in
Norway) are definitely not the rule in a world cup, other international or
national contest. The problem there is more often the limits of the field,
where you just can not do a 5-min-flyoff _and_ get your model back! (woods,
villages, crops,...).
So: why not reduce the model performance for the flyoff? F1C has shown the
feasibility with the rduced motor run of a couple of years back.
With F1B, however, reducing the rubber weight for the flyoff would lead to a
problem due to the extensive re-trimming necessary.
But another Idea comes to my mind: Why not add weight? Maybe Peter King can
calculate sensible steps, take the following just as a basic idea: for each
flyoff round add 30g of ballast. The glide would not be affected very much,
but the climb ...!
I do not believe, that a model would still do 3 min with 90g (3rd flyoff)
aboard. Of course you would have to prepare weights, a room for them (hollow
pylon?) and test fly to find out how your model would behave.
Anybody for a tryout?
But please: whatever you rulemakers do, remember the beginner! Do not kill
F1B like F1C is in effect killed, because nobody in his right mind will
start in this class anymore!
Regards
Klaus W. Salzer
.......................
Roger Morrell
