SEN 997 - 11 Mar 2006
- Category: Archive 2006
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SCAT Electronic News 11 March 2006 issue 997
Table of contents
F1J at SCAT Annual - Parker
e-mails from scat
NFFS BOM Rule Modification - Mattes
F1B hub news - Cyclon
F1B sale - Norval
Couple of Magic things - Ulm
Max Men & Viabon - woodhouse
Diesel engine - Cyclon
Mr. Francisco Collado
Scatbay - Bauer
Life in your LiPo ? - Death in your LiPo ? - Horejsi
F1J at SCAT Annual
Our published SCAT Annual rules with a 5 second engine run and 4 minute first
round max in F1J have resulted in both positive and negative responses.
We are approaching this for the 2006 SCAT Annual contest only and in no way
is it an America's Cup directive. We will review the results and make changes
as appropriate for 2007. I will address the concerns and the logic for this
There are two areas of concern, first being the "legality" of deviating from
the standard FAI rules and the second being why we are changing a fundamental
performance parameter, ie the reduced engine run.
SCAT is one of the premiers FAI FF clubs in the USA and the world. We take
that responsibility seriously. The AmCup rules state that the AmCup contests
are to be run to the FAI rules. So, from a rule standpoint, we are following
the FAI rule (see below), which allows local deviation from the FAI. It is
also at the discretion of the Contest Director to modify the Max time at any
time in a contest with the governing principle that a "sportsman like result"
is achieved. Many contests have used various extended round times and other
than the occasional grumble, this seem to be OK-- that is, it is not messing
with core model performance-- model weight, area, rubber weight, towline
length and motor run. The SCAT annual was chosen because it is early in th
e AmCup schedule and so would be of less impact to the AmCup results than th
at of our other SCAT contest, the Patterson, which is late in the season.
Why make the change? There are two driving reasons:
First is the age old discussion of model performance. I do not care to
reiterate all the arguments here but it is generally agreed that the current
state of performance of a modern F1J shadows its 2 minute max . Cutting the
engine run to 5 sec is the simplest way to reduce performance.
Second, achieving a timely result for the mini-events-- ie is this a contest
for the sportsman or the organizer? We did not make the F1J engine run and
extended 1st round maxes change to end the contest sooner for the organizer's
benefit. To that end we are using the flyoff cut off time approach using
a 1st round flight time to the ground to decide the winner if a tie remains
at the end of the flyoff time period. This has been used at the last couple
of Winter Classics and Las Vegas contests to good success and precludes
marathon flyoffs lasting late into a Sunday evening.
Some comments from our F1J flyers is the current F1J event is a fun and
exciting, the excess performance allows a more causal approach-- ie use the
5 regular ground for trimming to get reading for the fly-offs. To that end,
yes-a more prepared approach will be needed to make a 4 minute max with a 5
second engine run. We also lengthened the max time for the first rounds
in F1H and F1G for the same reason.
The F1J flyers are also concerned about the re-trimming of models to 5 sec
engine run for just this contest. The flyers seem split on this on the
difficulty to re-trimming. This concern resulted in the decision to leave
the 5 second engine run for all the rounds. The mini events at the SCAT
Annual are held on Sunday so hopefully there will be some great Lost Hills
evening conditions to re-trim.
Another concern is that these rules would chase away the "non- mini F1C"
flyers. To that end, I'm afraid that has already occurred. The few
"non-cyclon" F1J flyers that do fly are there to have fun and I hope this one
time rule change don't keep them away. We'll see on this one.
SCAT discussed these ideas and issues at several meetings and those in
attendance decided that we should be visionary- show leadership and be
willing to run a true FAI contest using these rules. This would provide at
least one data point to be used either positively or negatively should the
FAI consider similar rule change.
I hope we have a large F1J turn out so that this grand experiment will have
sufficient depth to better make future decisions. Please come out and fly,
and when its all over, give us feedback.
Thermals, Jim Parker
e-mails from scat
Talking to a few aeromodellers in the UK , John Barker and Phil Ball and
a few others, we all seem to have lost our connection with the SCAT
website.and would like to re-connect. If you get this e-mail could you
look into this for us if you can find the time.
Many thanks and hoping all is well with you and yours.
Walt and others - it appeats that my friends at btinternet and bt openworld
have decided that SEN is spam - you need to tak it up with them]
NFFS BOM Rule Modification
Please publish this in the SCAT mailing. It should save a few NOS
Models from the Grim Reaper.
At a recent NFFS Board of Directors meeting a proposal was accepted to
change the NFFS Builder of the Model rule to allow use of models built
by now deceased modelers in all NFFS outdoor events. Incorporation of
this rule will have no impact of ancillary programs such as the National
Cup. For example the flier of the model will continue to be credited
with points appropriate to their placing at the contest even if the
flier is using a model built by a deceased modeler as long as the model
meets the revised BOM rule.
The current NFFS rule now states: "The NFFS Competition Rules endorse
the AMA Builder of the Model Rule".
The rule is revised as follows: "The NFFS Competition Rules endorse the
AMA Builder of the Model Rule with the following exception. Models
built by now deceased modelers may be flown in any NFFS event. If such
models are flown the following are required:
1.. Builder's AMA number shall be retained with the addition of a "-
D" following said number. If no builder's AMA numbers are present the
flier shall add builder's last name to the upper left surface of the
wing followed by a "- D".
2.. Flier's AMA number shall be added to the model either immediately
above or below the builder's number on the right wing if present. If
builder's AMA number is not present the flier shall add their number to
the right wing.
3.. Use of parts from deceased builder's models is also allowed. If
such parts constitute a majority of the model, any two of the three
major assemblies for example, the deceased builder shall be identified
as in 1 and 2 above.
4.. Builder's identification/address label shall be removed and
replaced by flier's identification/address label.
5.. Model shall meet all other rules for the event in which it is
6.. Model may not be flown by more than one flier in any sanctioned
If you have any questions please contact Bob Mattes at
F1B hub news
Hello dear Free Flight flyer !
We have production the F1B Hub and the blades same type as Andrukov.
for FAI F1B category hub props
No.009-1 Propeller hub "VISH-M"(for experts)
Weight 35 g (no included blades)
No.009-1.07 Blades pair (balsa,cevlar,glass)
Best regards !
Phone/fax : +7 383 279 37 71
Phone/fax : +7 383 217 32 78
Roger Im thinning out my F1B stock and have to offer (2) models for sale.
Both are covered in orange airspan. Both have Andriukov front ends which are in
great shape. The first model is Andriukov's long model with a mechanical timer
and instant start. The second is Actherberg's 6 panel long model with a Cooney
electronic timer and instant start. Both models fly very well and are in great
shape. If there is a flyer out there looking to start in F1B I have an older 5
:1 winder with no torque meter which I will toss into the deal. Also included w
ill be one of the many Batiuk boxes I have for easy transportation. Oh the impo
rtant part cost How bout $500. So anybody interested email me iflyf1b@co
Im not out of the game just readjusting my hobby Larry Norvall Woodbridg
[ so larry are you changing your e-mail to ifyf2a ?]
Couple of Magic things
From: "Gene Ulm"
Maybe folks already know about. But could be useful for the
good of the order.
... Belkin makes a nimh replacement battery and charger setup
for palm pilots. Uses either household or cig ligher current.
19 bucks on the internet. No more lost black magic programs
off palm pilots!
... Servo jiggles. Tracked down to dirty pots on the servo...
Hard to figure considering our dust-free flying conditions. A
blast out with electronic cleaner curred the problem.
Max Men & Viabon
I have stuck a few of the images on the pages below.
Michael J Woodhouse, Norwich, UK.
Free Flight Supplies has secure internet credit card facilities.
All mail to: -
web site: -
Hello dear friend,
I I inform you about my new DIESEL engine 1,5 cc 2006 production !
Best regards !
F2A World Champion
Phone/fax : +7 383 279 37 71
Phone/fax : +7 383 217 32 78
Mr. Francisco Collado
if somebody know the Francisco Collado e-mail, please
My garage cleaning continues. Thanks for the interest in my model box
and old planes. I've decided to auction off some of the good stuff.
Last time I did this it worked pretty good, so I'll use Scatbay instead
of Ebay. I've give 10% to Roger for SEN support, and use the rest for
my son's Jr team support for our trip this summer. So here's a couple
1. Ultimate Dragmaster Kit.
Original A-2 kit by Tom Hutchinson. Never touched, all there. Starting
2. Ed Lamb's 41 Nats Winner "Climber" rubber model kit
>From 4K models. 44 5/8" span, Power 12-16 strands 1/4 rubber. Kit
Starting bid $20
If interested, email me with your bid. I'll give it about a week, let
you know if you were outbid, then give to the highest bidder. If
shipping is needed, add another $10.
Thanks, Ken Bauer
Life in your LiPo ? - Death in your LiPo ? -
After two years experience with the LiPo batteries selling and accepting
warrancy claims I can answer:
The LiPos are very sensitive. Impropper treatment can damage or destroy them
The LiPos are excellent and safe power supply, provided they are treated
correctly with just few basic facts in mind:
1. It is ABSOLUTELLY NECESSARY to use a special LiPo charger, with the CC/CV
(constant current/constant voltage) program, which can also end the charging
automatically. The "idle charging" is not recommended. Use the charger with
good reputation only, some of them are not good (voltage peaks).
2. It is highly recommended to use the voltage balancers, which divide the
voltage evenly to the individual cells.
3. NEVER discharge the battery lower than 3V per cell. 2,5 V is killing. It
is siple to achieve by the speed controller. Always disconnect physically
the speed controller after the flying. If left attached, it draws still some
small current from the battery and after 3 days the battery is dead.
4. The LiPos current is always rated at xC continuous, yC peak. But nobody
gives any warrancy regarding the number of the charging cycles under high
load. If the battery is loaded continuously with the current between xC and
yC, the life can be quite short. Lets say 50 cycles. Hardly anybody knows
the behavior of the battery when discharged repeatedly by high current
during very short time periods, typical for free flight. I would guess that
such a treatment can be well tolerated by the LiPos.
5. Never use blown-up (fat) battery.
6. Read the instructions.