SEN 1469

Table of Contents - SEN 1469

  1. Straw Poll Clarification
  2. SEN editor observation
  3. MMM team selection ideas
  4. Motivation and the role of the World Champs
  5. World Champs Reporting

Straw Poll Clarification

Reminder: sen is not the point for FAI Program questionnaire data collection.  Only responses sent to: This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. will be counted.  Also, this is not an attempt to collect data from those who didn't originally submit questionnaires.  It is an attempt to collect "clarification" data from those who already answered question #4.  Thanks.


Chuck Etherington

FFTSC Co-Chairman

SEN editor (not SCAT) observation

We sent both Chuck's straw Poll information out last night because there seemed to be some urgency, ... and the last time we did not sent some out fast enough the TSC complained to the SCAT president about our poor performance.

In our hurry to get them out we did not make the usual observations ...

In a earlier SEN Aram talked about a regional/central system that is one on the list and and the list also had a multi-contest form choice also.  Both Aram and Chuck talked about getting argreement or understanding of the principles of the preferred method of selection and would go into the details later.

If we look at the ideas that people have presented about the multi-contest format there is the original Mike idea with just Lost Hills Contests, Roger's more developed idea that had 6 contests from 2 sites and finally Gene's idea that more contests from a larger number of sites.

One of the reasons people voted the status quo  and I thought this way my self, particularily before acquiring semi-geezer status was - looking at the multi-contest I would be OK with Mike's and probably Roger's but no-way with Gene's because I could not afford the time to attend all the contests. It would be even worse if people extrapolated the multi-contest to the America's Cup.  If one is serious and regards the elimination of luck a key reason for the multi-contest format then one has to take part in all contests to get the best score and stop major opponents from scoring to eliminate having to take part in a "lucky" sudden death shoot out   at the end as a tie breaker.

The same with Aram's regional proposal, the choice or region is critical as it effects the number of people taking part in the regional contests.

In the past what would happen is the TSC would go into committee with this high level input and come up with a proposal and the format doe not permit discussion just an accept or reject vote.  Given this choice  I would always vote for the status quo.

Finally on the administrative side to avoid being trapped by the anti-spam police we have to throttle the rate that SEN is sent by e-mail. It takes about 5 hours from when the transmission starts to when the last one is sent.  We start it running and go away, we come back from time to time to make sure it is still working and at the end typically have to restart it to catch up any stragglers.  On top of that it can take over an hour to format, do editorial content...

So the rate we have been going over the last couple of week is getting in the way of my program to move to semi-geezer, professional sportsman status and well as bring out some exciting new Magic Timers, I was not planning on all this time at the keyboard....

Re: Team Selection ideas

Don't forget about the two America's Cup events sponsored by the MMM Club in Denver when discussing a multi contest format.

Jerry Murphy
9 Via Escondido Valle
Manitou Springs, CO 80829

Jerry - I'm sure your TSC member will include the MMM contests in the details :-)

Seriously I did enjoy flying at your site and look forward to coming back. You might even be on the right side of the Rockies to be with the good guys. Just as well you said this as there was an popular belief that the MMM did not want 'big' events at their site.

Motivation and the Role of the World Champs

Bigglesworth old chap, I think we should separate the washing of our dirty laundry from the buying of new clothes.

On the finals most people are having trouble figuring what's best for them let alone some teenager who that do not understand?  depending on how it is implemented the multi-contest format of team selection is likely to move contest away from the  requirement to be at Lost Hills for a couple of weeks in October, conflicting with school time. 

It was great to have Austin Gunder's thoughtful input.  Clearly the way he bounds across the fiel
d to catch his F1C model he is far from geezer status and it was great to get his perspective.  I have been disappointed that we get only limited participation from younger people.  Even though he has not spoken up on this issue we have welcomed Ben Coussens's input in the past and I was very disappointed one time when someone tried to blow him off because of his youth, fortunately Ben is not easily discouraged.

We have included in SEN information from Facebook. Many people have concerns about FB yet on the other side it is a communications medium that many, including younger people embrace and i believe that we will need link with that capture some of the audience that you are talking about. That is something for an upcoming SCAT meeting maybe?

I think we need to be going outside of the modelling community for new recruits so I'm not sure how effective going after SAM, NFFS etc , unless it is to get their children and grand children to participate in the junior programs. Regular SAM flyers for example like building and flying those classic models and have rules that suite the way they do things.  I read a number of online modeling and message boards and am saddened by the some bitter critisim of FAI flying from non-FAI flyers and vice versa one would almost think it was two regular political parties going at each other rather than a bunch of guys flying toy airplanes for their enjoyment.  I watch Andrew Barron cringe at recent ESFFC when someone said that a F1C model costs $15K, clearly not true and Andrew set about correcting it and then the a person who won a  lot the AMA event proposed his solution which was to ban all electronics, particularily in the form of Thermal detectors. More cringing from Andrew even though the event he and his family fly don't use electronic thermal detection he spends a lot of time around young people and knows where there heads are?  See Oliver Cai's embedded system blimp on FB for example. Apologies to Andrew on my, perhaps incorrect interpretation of his facial expressions :-).

Not many people, particularily from the USA get to fly in the World Champs and if we recruit more people an even smaller percent will go. So we need to provide other opportunites for motivation and the participation in international events that we like so much.  One suggestion would be expanding the World Cup to include the Mini-events, these, F1G in particular are very popular in the America's Cup and one can build or buy a hi tech model much cheaper than for the big events and one can still do very with a more traditional model.

I have done a few sessions with organizations like the Boy Scouts but probably not enough.  It is very hard to make the step from a Delta Dart that you can fly in the scout hall to even a P-30 that needs a much bigger space.  Not sure how we do this . Certainly kudos to Art Ellis and Rocco Ferrario for their programs.

World Champs Reporting

Regarding Biggles point on the AMA magazines failure to run articles on the Junior World Championships held in Romania, I understand that it's their editorial policy to only cover Championships held in the USA. That was certainly the case in 2005, which was why my Championships report was in Flying Models rather than Model Aviation. You may think that's a pretty short-sighted policy for the USA's largest air sports body, specially if one of its aims is the encouragement of excellence; I, of course, couldn't possibly comment...
Martin Dilly

Roger Morrell