SEN 973 - 18 Sept 2005
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SCAT Electronic News 18 Sept 2005 issue 973
Table of Contents
==================
F1E World Championships 2005 - Brocks
180 Is Max - Stalick
Foam building beds - Kargol
The Bear meets the Champ - Hotard
Non European Entries to European Champs 0 EoB
Moncontour 2 minutes results 2005 ? - Evatt
40th Annual Rocky Mt FF champs and Dynasty Cup results - Murpphy and Deloach
Free flight club near Munich - Ewibg
National Cup - Edmonson
for SEN: Which way to warp - a stab! - Salzer
Strands - Woodhouse
Kanegawa's Model - Kanagawa and Mogel
bike and trailer for sale - Brush
Contest reports et al... - Segrave
Looking for 180 [aren't we all !]
Patterson - Norton
Find the battery Number - Brokenspar
SEN editorial policy
Fillon and more - Mate
Non-Euro Flyers at Euro-Champs - Dilly
F1J props
F1A Front Noses
F1E World Championships 2005
============================
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I am in an Internet cafe in Liptovsky Mikulas in Slovakia. Yesterday, on
Sep. 15 we had the F1E World Champs here. We flew from a beautiful green
hill overlooking a lake.
The results in the individual Senior Category in percent are:
1. Stanislav Kubit POL 500 100 100
2. Milan Mravec SVK 500 100 66
3. Vincent Croghan USA 500 100 65
4. Ivan Treger SVK 500 100 63
5. Pierre Chaussebourg FRA 500 100 54
6. Dan Petcu ROM 500 100 47
7. Herbert Schmidt GER 500 100 45
8. Thomas Ioerger USA 500 100 45
18. Peter Brocks USA 485
22. Robert Sifleet WC USA 463
The Team Placings (Seniors) are:
1. France 1500
2. USA 1485
3. Slovakia 1456
4. Czech Republic 1433
5. Germany 1358
The USA did well with Vince Croghan placing 3rd and the USA Team placing 2nd!
See you in Lost Hills, Peter
180 Is Max
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Regarding the availability of the video, 180 is Max. The NFFS has been in
contact with the Canadian Film Board, who currently owns the rights for this
video. The video is for sale from them only in VHS format. It appears that we
will not be able to purchase the rights to produce this video in DVD format for
our membership, because the Canadian Film Board will not release it to us. We
are now investigating whether we might be able to purchase a quantity of this
video to distribute to our members here in the USA at a reduced cost.
I will keep all SEN readers of our progress.
Thanks also to Bill Shailor who forwarded a copy of the video to me for
review.
Bob Stalick, NFFS Publications Services
Foam building beds
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Does anyone know where I can get foam building beds cut for an specific
under-camber airfoil?
Denny
The Bear meets the Champ
==========================
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Bob White called me to tell me the following: As you
know, Bob & Jean live in Monrovia, on a street in the foothills. Their
street has been on TV several times because there is a Mother Bear with a cub,
roaming around, and this bear took a swim in a neighbor's pool, and the guy
got it on video. Not sure if it also went into the hot tub. Bob is careful not
to spend a lot of time out in his yard at night because of the bear. The
other day, Bob was working on a model in his workshop, on the side of his back
yard garage (think he is building a Gollywok) when he looked up, and there in
the open door was the bear. Bob got all excited, started yelling, grabbed a
broom and waved it, and the bear took off. (got to admit--if Bob started
yelling at me and waving a broom--I'd take off too!!) Anyway, that's the bear
story. So, whatever problems you may have building models--Bob has got you
beat!!--Al Hotard
Non European Entries to European Champs
=======================================
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Great Uncle SCAT,
I confer with Mike Woodhouse over the suggestion to include non-Europeans at
the European Champs in 2006. Reading Jim Parker's letter in SEN it seems the
arguments for inclusion of (specifically) a US team are mainly that a) it
gives flyers and organisers a view of the field prior to the 2007 world champs
and b) it gives access to another high level contest of a standard not flown
local to the US.
Point a) is taken care of by access to open internationals already flown and
planned for the same site before the 2007 world champs. I remember well
that some US flyers attended contests including the 2002 European champs
prior to the 2003 world champs in Hungary which gave them access to
information they needed to plan for 2003. The same will be true for the
Odessa site. Point b) should be a non-starter. If the US did hold something
like a Pan-American champs again would Europeans be allowed to fly as well ?
Whilst there are advantages for the US and other non-European teams in
attending, the downside for the devaluation of the European champs is
obvious. I seem to remember a US F1C flyer "winning" a European champs in
the 70's; how do you think the guy who came 2nd but actually was crowned
felt ? As a F1A flyer additional non-scoring competitors would significantly
add to the traffic and potential for line crossing etc. A non-European
competitor would loose nothing for line tangleling (no world cup points etc)
whilst an official team member would have a particular disadvantage.
In summary the history of the European champs should be maintained. There are
able opportunities to review the site and facilities prior to the 2007 world
champs which no doubt will have been taken advantage of anyway and any
additional non-scoring competitors will increase the risk of flying problems
on the day. I suggest the energies of those interested in pursuing this
option are spend in setting up an equivalent Pacific/Atlantic championships
that the rest of the world can benefit from.
Respectfully,
EoB
PS Pleased to see SEN's editor taking to the air in the UK recently. I hope he
has now dried out ....
[Great nephew EoB
I can report that all is dry .. and after practical experiments
that no matter how hard the ground is at both Lost Hills and Waegel Field
at the end of summer the runway at Barkston is much harder !
It was also good to see that other Pseudo Kiwi Martin Gregorie
up and about - and working on ideas for his F1Q model. While wishing to
extend to the August world body the same respect that EoB extends
to me it does sound like the F1Q specs do not take into account
the latest in electric motor and battery technolgy and the sportsmen
will voulentarily shorten the motor run so it does not go oos straight
up. Predictions give about 3 times the altitude of a F1J! because
of the longer motor run for the same size but slightly heavier model.
Some of the brushless motors people are looking at give 80% of the
power of a Cyclon with a much more efficent prop. ]
Moncontour 2 minutes results 2005
=================================
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Hi Roger,
I have lost my copy of the results of the 2005 Moncontour 2 minutes
results for all classes - If any SCAT readers have a copy I would
appreciate a copy.
A electronic copy would be best but a photocopy by snail mail would be
OK
Regards
Mike Evatt
6 Armley Close
Long Buckby
Northampton
NN6 7YG
United Kingdom
40th Annual Rocky Mt FF champs and Dynasty Cup results
======================================================
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Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The 40th anniversary of the Rocky Mountain FF Champs was conducted in
Denver over the labor day weekend with GREAT conditions for all three
days. the 40 people who made the trip to the 27,000 acre MMM fiwld were
treated to a great contest. Special 40th Anniversary trophies were
awarded to the event winners.
The Dynasty cup results are as follows.
F1A (5/4) R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 R6 R7 Total
1st Pete McQuade 180 180 180 101 88 180 180 1089
2nd Mike Fedor 180 180 180 180 180 68 119 1087
3rd Gary Baughman 180 180 180 130 0 50 0 720
4th Willard Smitz 44 57 222 32 59 51 0 354
F1B (6/4) R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 R6 R7 Total
1st E. Vanlandingham 160 180 180 145 165 180 87 1097
2nd Ed Wiley 144 142 180 54 85 180 178 963
3rd Dick Wood 180 180 168 102 82 46 47 805
4th Darold Jones 56 0 0 0 0 0 0 56
F1C (1/0)
F1P (1/1) R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 R6 R7 Total
1st Mike Fedor 92 180 180 180 0 0 0 632
F1H (6/4) R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 Total
1st Mike Fedor 120 120 120 114 120 594
2nd Willard Smitz 120 90 59 45 92 406
3rd Rick Pangell 68 95 120 55 63 401
4th Pete McQuade 0 70 120 0 0 190
F1G (8/6) R1 R2 R3 R4 R5 Total
1st Jerry Murphy 120 120 120 120 120 600
2nd Ed Vanlandingham120 120 120 61 120 541
3rd Ed DeLoach 88 120 120 89 120 537+119
4th Ed Wiley 120 120 120 57 120 537+95
5th Darold Jones 0 120 30 120 120 390
6th Mel Gray 120 90 101 120 0 341
F1J (3/0)
As a free flight community we need to do a better job of scheduling
major events. When the date was set for the Dynasty Cup and the 40th
annual RMC it was believed that the Lost Hills contest would be held on
its traditional date in early October. Due to a lack of a national or
even regional communications system this was not the case and this great
meet failed to draw a single flyer from west of Salt Lake City. This is
a loss for all of free flight as two major events were held on the same
weekend and many flyers failed to have the opportunity to gain America's
and National Cup points. I hope we can get NFFS to replace the current
outmoded contest coordinator function of AMA. If we wish for free
flight to be a strong competitive base we need to prevent date conflicts
like this in the future. Otherwise venues outside of Muncie and Lost
Hills will wither and die.
Don Deloach
Jerry Murphy
co-CDs MMM Club
Free flight club near Munich
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I'll be relocating to Manching Germany (north of Munich) next month. Is
there a free flight club in the area?
Thanks,
Rick Ewing
National Cup
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Hi Bob
How are the national cup point totals going? I see there has been no
posting since July 12.
I am wondering if all of the clubs offering so many events with one or
two entrants has really made the whole program difficult?
I am working out events for the MMAC 2006 season, and I think we will
just skip Classic Gas. Classic gas models can be flown in normal gas
events, and if someone wants to fly Classic or complains about being
non-competitive, let them go down to NOS gas. I am telling guys if they
want to fly Classic, go to the NATS.
We worked our schedule down to 9 events for a one day meet this year,
but combining so many events that it was hard to even figure out who was
flying what in that event and how to report it for national cup points?
We also tried to cut down to 3 contest weekends which proved to be a
disaster. A couple of bad weekends, and your whole season is shot. We
had fun flys scheduled in between contests, but those were virtually
unattended.
I have also been reading the contest results from around the country,
and see very few entrants in most events at major meets, with way..way.
too many events.
>From the guy who brought 30 models to the NATS to fly 18 events, and who
actually flew 13, and neglected to fly an additional 2 on Friday in
order to look for lost models!
Dave Edmonson
C.C.: Roger Morrell, SCAT
for SEN: Which way to warp - a stab!
====================================
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A question for the glider experts:
On my best thermal hunting glider (which, alas, has flown away after 25
years of service) one of the properties was a badly warped stab - and
replacing it with a straight one would take away the superior thermalling
properties.
So I built a new fuselage rear for one of my other planes with a two piece
stab, on which both halves can be adjusted separately.
Now the question is: which side should have more negative incidence - the
one inside or the one outside the turn?
I won't disturb your thoughts with flight tests as yet ... and I really do
not know which way the old one was warped.
I will tabulate your replys ... and do not promise to follow them!
regards
your balsa-loving Austrian
Klaus Salzer
Strands
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Roger
You were using, I think, 1mm rubber at Stonehenge? However strands and whats
the advantage? I assume a smoother run and more turns?
Well despite Saturady we managed an event. I saved my worst flight for the
fly off!
Michael J Woodhouse, Norwich, UK.
Free Flight Supplies has secure internet credit card facilities.
All mail to: -
web site: -
[Mike
John Clapp produces the Super Sport also in 1/16. This is a not standard size
so that it requires some xtra work on his part so goes for a slight premium.
John reports that some worthies such asn Burdov use it on thier F1Gs,
for better results.
A number of people have reported that you get somewhere between 10 amd 20%
more turns on a motor compared with a 1/8 motor of the same length. The
20% is a little optomistic but you do get more turns.
I do not believe the unwinds is noticleably smoother.
Actually in listening to the top english F1B sportsmen .. oops in the BFMA
they are flyers ... most seem to have as much Tan 2 stashed away as
Silz or Zeri. So why do they care !
The only good news for us real world sportsmen on that is that based on
meaurements that Alex Andrivkov has done the Tan 2 loses is potency over
time. So you had better use it while you can.
Back to the 1/16. It does give more turns, im not really sure if
if really is noticably better than the 1/8 from the same batch. Maybe if
I stop galavanting for work I'll do some back to back tests.
The fact that you did not notice it before Stonenege shows that the US
psych warefare program failed .. We did have it in Cordoba
and you guys were supposed see it and wonder what stuff the Yanks had
up their sleeves. Maybe you did wonder but it wasn'y 1/16 rubber.
I can report that making motors is a right pain as it tangles very easily
compared with 1/8. ]
Kanegawa's Model
================
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Hi Roger,
I'VE received the following from F1C flyer Shigeru Kanegawa. He wishes to
describe the modeling situation in Japan as well as clarify some of the
details of his F1C winning model. I did some minor editing at his
request. Please publish this if it meets your guidelines.
Rod Mogle
>From Shigeru Kanegawa:
Japanese free flight:
I saw many articles on the Scat electronic news about my victory of the
F1C event. Some of the articles are not entirely correct so I would like
to explain more about Japanese free flight situations.
I think everybody is surprised at my victory since I am not famous among
F1C flyers. Most surprised was myself.
Japanese FF is the most handicapped of any country doing free flight all
over the world. For example, we have only a very small field. There are
no large fields in Japan. A rice field is the only one we can use for
practice and competition. The ground is up and down and is covered with
rice stubble. We can use it only from September until April. Due to bad
field conditions the models are frequently damaged.
My winning model is very new. I did not check its final adjustment until
departing for Argentina. Indeed, I had practice of launching it but I did
only a short glide test (30sec) due to our small field. I didn't know the
performance of my model until the World Championship. During the first 5
minutes round, I didn't have confidence of my model’s performance. I
tested my model bit by bit during the rounds. Finally I finished
adjustment of my model after 7 rounds. I had confidence about my climb
performance. The very efficient propeller pulled the model to enough
altitude.
In Japan we don't have the opportunity to participate in the
international contests. For the European flyer, many contests are held in
the summer time. I've never participated in an international contest
since 2003 Hungary World Championship. Also I did not participate in the
world cup just before WC.
Many misunderstand the appearance of my model, so I will briefly explain
about it. Indeed Verbitsky is my best friend. I have purchased many parts
from him. Many Japanese F1C flyers use his complete models like many
American F1C flyers do. I did not fly his complete models although his
horizontal tail and a vertical stabilizer are certainly being used. I
used a GK Hummer and Ken Oliver fuselage and Mogle electronic timer.
Those are all made in USA. I used a Pisany wing from the Ukraine (not
Acterburg’s as reported) for my Wining Model. I named my model “YAKUMO”
This Japanese name means, cloud to well up and which rises like a
thermal. Even though I used many existing parts this model is my own
design. Though my name isn't known among in the free flight world some
people will remember the early D/T at the Israel World Championship. I
have participated in the World Championships the last 10 years as a
Japanese F1C team member. This time I was also team manager
Shigeru Kanegawa
[Thanks to Kanagawa San for his article. As I've said before we
very much appreciate material from nno-native English speakers
particularily those of his calibre. You can see the limit
of my Japanese in these few sentences ! In reading all the article about the
Champs there was clearly a lot of confusion about the model and it was
great to get clarification from the Sportsman himself. As someone
who has to travel long distance to most World Champs we apprreciate the
logistical effort by those who have to trave even further evry time.]
bike and trailer for sale
==========================
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Hi Roger, please put this on SCAT for me if you would.
Al Brush's Honda 110 trial bike for sale. 3272 miles.
Good condition. Missing one tail light.
$800.
Zieman dual trailer to carry one or two bikes. Spare tire and rack.
$300. If you buy both bike and trailer, $1,000.
A single carry on rack to carry one bike
on the back of a car or SUV, free if you buy trailer or bike.
Thank you for your consideration.
Tina Brush (Al Brush's wife)
Sun City, CA 92586
This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
951-301-9975
Contest reports et al...
=========================
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The last Scat news published a note from Ken Bauer(I think) about
interesting doings in freeflight. I have reported on the World Junior Champs
in my "One Year....04" which was produced last year(natch!) and is available
for $7.00 or £5.00 post free. There are other articles on indoor models and
tailless Cdhs, too.
This year, as part of the "One year.....05" I went to the Salzland Cup, site
of the 06 Juniors W/C partly as a reconnaissance and partly to report on the
contest itself. Those who have read the 04 report speak very highly of it
so assuming I can maintain the same quality, it should be quite something to
read. (like Bauer's!).
I then went to the Eifel Pokal at Zulpich(pronounced Soolpeach) and am in
the process of editing this second part of this reportage for the "05". The
second edition will be out sometime around December this year. Same price.
It has VERY often been said that there are no magazines on freeflight, and
fliers bewail this lack without end. When Aeromodeller ceased, long were
the plaints. I remember one particular flier who then said its no loss.
Perhaps because there was little f/f material therein. But surely not buying
the magazine is one way to hasten its demise, is that not so?
By the same token, when a new magazine comes out, do these self same
modellers buy this new publication???? Are you kidding? Do they leaf through
this new publication and then decide not to buy it, either because it does
not mention their name or does not contain an article on their pet
category?? What do you think?
You couldn't make it up, I tell you
Regards
Mike S
Looking for 180 [aren't we all !]
=================================
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Hi Roger,
Is there an email address I can send to for "180 is a max" ? I tried the
phone number in the last SEN but I was advised that I was either put in a queue
or rang out of hours. Ringing from Australia on international rates didn't
seem like a good idea anyway so the email option seems more desirable. ( If yo
ur
telephone queues in America are anything like Australia I could be waiting
for up to half an hour and have no money left to buy the video)
John Lewis (This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.)
Patterson
=========
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PATTERSON FAI INVITATIONAL 2005
America Cup Contest. Sanction 05 1661
Lost Hills, CA
November 12 - 13 2005
F1A, B, C, G, H, J, P
Trophies for 1st, 2nd, 3rd --1st only for F1P
J, S, O classes combined
Junior High Time Award
SCHEDULE
5 Rounds for F1G, H, J
Saturday - 5 - 45 minute rounds, start at 0730 - All regular rounds are
120 seconds except 180 seconds for F1P
10 Rounds for F1 A B C
All rounds are 180 Seconds except:
Round 5 on Saturday is 300 seconds for F1 ABC
Round 6 on Sunday is 240 seconds for F1A & P --300 seconds for B, and C
( NOT a supermax )
Weather conditions could be changed due to weather condiitions.
Saturday
Round Mini G, H, J Open F1 A,B,C,P
1. 0730 - 0815 1100 -
1230 ( note round overlap
2. 0815 - 0900 1200 -
1300
3. 0900 - 0945 1300 -
1400
4. 0945 - 1045 1400 -
1500
5. 1045 - 1130 1500 -
1600 300 sec max for F1A,B,C,P
Mini event flyoff to start at approximately 1615,. Actual start time
and Max times will be posted at CD table. Flyoff participants are to
provide timer to Flyoff officer 10 minutes before start of flyoff.At the
discretion of the CD and availability of resources, a traveling timer
may be used for the longer flyoff flights in addition to the standard
flight line timer.
Sunday
Round Open F1A,B,C,P
6. 0730 - 0830 240 second F1A, P - 300 second F1B, C
7. 0830 - 0930.
8. 0930 - 1030
9. 1030 - 1130
10. 1130 - 1230
Open event Flyoff to start at approximately 1330. Start time and max
times will be posted at CD table. Flyoff participants to provide timer
to Flyoff officer 10 minutes before flyof.
The contest will governed by current FAI and AMA regulations and as
noted. Valid AMA and Lost Hills Association cards required. Score Cards
are to be returned to the CD table every round.
Time one - fly one. Find your own timer.
FEES:
Open: $20.00 For first event - $10.00 for any added events.
Jr and Senior ages: $10.00 for first event - $5.00 for added events.
Sponsored by: Southern California Aero Team
CD: Bob Norton ( 661 ) 395-0261
Assistant CD - Don Leath
find the battery number
========================
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Old Brokenspar has a KCL Temp Tech electronoic sensor,
Digital Thermometer. Made in Hong Kong, 2 1/2 x 2 1/2
x 5/8 tnick, black plastic case. Thermister on a 4ft cord...
He lost the original battery*, so does not know what to get
at the hardware store...
he tried three batterys ( opening the packages ) and struck out...
When these sensors first came out there were quite a few of them
in use by others, so I'm hoping.....when you read this, you'll check it
out,
make a battery number note on SCAT !
* Well, the last time I wuz in Muncie, I took the battery out,
and put it in my shirt pocket.
I was going to stop by at Radio Shack,......see......
SEN editorial policy
====================
Note that we generally do not either edit ot not print material
that we receive from readers. Some time something will not be printed
because it was a question that someone already answered. Very rarely I will
stop a chain of messages .. either silently or with a comment if I consider
that has gone on for too long and is no longer productive or interesting.
We do however change the subject ot title of the piece on a regular basis ...
if every subject was re SCAT Electronic News .... etc it would be rather boring.
On a similar vein of reducing boredom we do remove the junk that was in the message
from the old SEN you used to get the address and were too busy to delete.
We very much appreciate the people who take time time to write something -
technical, event report or of human interst like Ken Bauer's story of
his HLG landing on a busy california freeway and being rescued by the CHP.
Particularily if that person is not a native english speaker .. as i know
how tough it is for me when have to write French.
We, the contributors and all the lurkers [those who read but do not write]
appeciate it very much when you reply to a request for information
to SEN [as well as directly to the requestor] so that we all can benefit from you
knowledge.
Fillon and more
===============
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My deep regard and condolences on the passing of one of my inspirational
heros Emmanuel FILLON. On a lighter note "Meteorboat" is progressing. I
said one of the disadvantages of a flying boat is being able to fly as a
boat only. NOT SO! I am working it out as a removable hull. "How bout
dat!" As my ol pal Pete Sotich used to say. Ed Mate
Non-Euro Flyers at Euro-Champs
==============================
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A word of caution regarding the proposal to make the European Championships
open to non-European flyers.
The idea of having an F1A European Championships where a member of a
legitimate European team might lose a model or a flight as a result of, for
example, a line cross with a flyer who isn't even in a team with which he
is competing, worries me. On the one hand the more competitors we can get
to a contest, the better; on the other hand it is actually a Continental
Championships and as such is open to eligible national teams, not
individuals.
As I understand it one or more World Cup contests are planned for the same
site before and/or after the Euro Champs. Surely these would give ample
opportunity for people to reconnoiter the site for the 2007 World
Championships.
Martin
F1J props
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Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Need an F1J prop. Can anyone supply me with an email address for Vasily
Bachevsky (lousy spelling, probably) or other supplier. Thanks, Dick
Nelson
F1A Front Noses
=======================================
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F1A Front Noses
Hi all,
Im looking to purchase 1 or 2 front noses for F1A - Victor Stamov
style/design, but
the old type being sold prior to the release of his newest one piece design.
These were the two-piece design noses but with the large faceplate/cover
(not to be confused with the even older two piece design with the small
cover).
If anyone has any available that they would be interested in selling, please
let me know.
Chris Lenartowicz
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................
Roger Morrell
