SEN 1041 - 26 Oct 2006
- Category: Archive 2006
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SEN issue 1041 26 October 2006
Table of contents
Locked in a Cell
Autumn Cup announcement - Simpson
2007 F1E Team Selection program - Davis
English Cooked - Bryant
Search for Wireless Flight Timer- Morris
English Cooking - Tribe
Found at the Finals/Sierra Cup - Mc Keever
Biggles on fire- Ulm
Biggles to Jimbo, Over
Locked in a cell
What Mobile phone provider works best at Lost Hills, T-Mobile,
my provider is very marginal ?
Autumn Cup announcement
Everyone is invited to the 22th Annual Autumn Cup, the second weekend of
EVENT Autumn Cup (An American Cup and Texas Cup Contest)
DATE November 11-12, 2006
PLACE Seguin Texas, USAF Auxiliary Field (Gate opens at 7:00AM)
Located on US 90 Alternate, approx. 1.5 miles east of Hwy
SPONSOR Tri-City Flyers MAC 830
CONTEST DIRECTOR Reid Simpson (903) 677-8525
115 Trailridge Dr.
Athens, TX 75751
F1A, F1B, F1C, F1P Open Gas, 7 one hour rounds,
Start - 9:00 AM (No Super Max)
P-30, not flown by rounds
F1G, F1H, F1J, 5 one hour rounds, start 8:00 AM
NFFS Special event, (Starduster-X/Zero/Mini Pearl)
(not flown by rounds)
SOCIAL TIME A social time will be held at the El Ranchito
Restaurant at 7:00 Saturday evening.
The awards for the Saturday events
will be presented at the social time if the events are finished, or else
at the end of the contest Sunday.
ENTRY FEES Open entries - 1 event $15.00, 2 or more $20.00
Sr. entries 1 event $ 7.00,2 or more
Jr. entries no charge
2007 F1E Team Selection program
2007 F1E Team Selection program
We all know that there has been turmoil in the F1E team selection
program for 2007. I don't need to hash out the details of how things
got to where they are other than to say that it was done and created
by one person who had no communication with the potential F1E
participants. Everything that has taken place after that has been in
reaction to the program that was sprung on us in mid summer.
It was clear to me in late summer that the plan for an October 2006
F1E finals would be a three man finals, based on a poll of the
potential fliers. I worked hard to get the 2006 date moved to 2007.
My proposal was a compromise; I worked to move the date so that more
fliers could attend, including myself. Based on the premise that the
finals had to be held in Kansas (a dictate of the F1E committee of
one) the only possible dates had to be as late as possible in spring
to avoid the winds and cold temperatures. A date in late spring in
Kansas was accepted by the AMA. At the time, I felt it was a decent
idea and a compromise that might work. I was wrong.
During the recently held finals, I made a point of talking to most of
the F1E fliers who have flown at the past Lost Hills contests and I
began to get a different picture of the state of our fledgling F1E
efforts. It turns out that there is a reasonable number of F1E fliers
who are making their way into F1E at a pace that is requisite with
learning a brand new event. In life, all of us walk before we run. As
we all know from our past modeling experiences we get into a new
event slowly, one model at a time and learn as we go. If the event is
fun and challenging enough, we then get more models and get more
serious about it.
When we first started flying F1E from Holloway Summit, the idea was
to use it as an incubator to build the number of people flying F1E.
I'm happy to report the number of F1E fliers at our Holloway Summit
contests has gone up each year. That is not to be construed to mean
that we have a large enough core of serious fliers to have the luxury
of a team finals in the middle of Kansas where no F1E fliers live
( as was decided by one person). After talking with the F1E fliers,
including some of the ones who have been behind the Kansas site, I
have come to the conclusion that if the F1E finals are held in Kansas
in early June there will be three or four fliers at most. This will
increase the polarization of the F1E fliers and the finals will be a
sham. F1E needs the input or agreement of the bulk of the F1E
modelers and, to support this new event, we should hold the finals
where it would be most convenient to the most participants,
encouraging its development. As more fliers from around the country
join us and the event matures, finals could be held anywhere in the
At last years F1E contest at the Holloway Summit a vote was taken of
the fliers and it was virtually unanimous that it should be held at
the Holloway Summit. Almost all of us came away from that vote
knowing that the finals would be held between the Issacson and Max
Men contests, much as our recent ABC finals were held between the
Livotto and Sierra Cup contests. Without any communication with the
fliers, the team selection committee accepted the program devised by
one person and sprung it on us. This was a huge mistake. Allowing our
program to progress like this will be the death knell of F1E in the
US. Two wrongs do not make a right and now is the time to reverse the
mistake and follow the will of the majority by holding the finals at
Holloway Summit. The infrastructure is in place to hold the finals
there in mid February and the number of fliers will be enough to
allow for a legitimate contest with a team being selected from more
than 3 or 4 fliers. Whatever the merits of the Summit, we will all be
flying from the same place at the same time and all of the potential
F1E fliers will be there anyway attending the other two contests.
What is important here is that we put all our efforts into growing
the number of F1E fliers so that we eventually have a solid core of
serious fliers. We do not have that at the present time and it is
obvious to virtually all of us. I believe the team selection
committee was sold a flawed bill of goods and that what came from
that will cause much more harm than good. If any of you on the team
selection committee doubt this, I urge you to select a neutral member
of your committee to call all of the F1E fliers and have a candid
conversation with them and then report back to the committee. The
paramount issue is what is best for our fledging F1E efforts.
Everything else should be subordinate to the goal of increasing
Any of you who are currently or considering flying F1E are urged to
contact your representative on the team selection committee and tell
them how you feel about what has happened. The fliers have spoken but
their overwhelmingly majority vote was cast aside. That needs to be
rectified. The F1E finals need to be held at the Holloway Summit in
February as voted on by the fliers. Any other outcome is a disregard
of our democratic principles and a hijacking of the program. If the
program continues to grow we can consider having the finals in Kansas
at a later time.
Before you guys get really fired up about Brit food, let me tell you
here and now that the only 2 times in my life I got food-poisoning were
in Milwaukee and Dallas, both so-called restaurants. And when I was
forced by my employer into a long-term sojourn at a Holiday Inn in
Cleveland I drove 12 miles to a rib-joint rather than consume the
they served up labeled as food in my hotel. So leave it out.
We Brits eat damn well. And yes, we do know how to cook a steak....
Search for Wireless Flight Timer
I'm surfing the Internet in search of a telematics device that will time
free flight model from launch to touchdown by wireless means from the
line. Airborne weight and time resolution are important. Anyone knowing
existing device or person willing and able to so develop, please contact
I have not seen an off the shelf device.
Ken Bauer and I have discussed this a number of times. The technology is certainly
there, although the Radio part could be a little tough to make it 100 % bullet
proof as the model could land in a spot where transmission was blanked. But you
could get very close by transmitting progress through out the flight. And how about
board video to keep spectator excitement up !
Looking at the pressure sensing technology used in the altimeters we use and
some similar motion sensors we believe that we can determine if a plane
is still airborne. Having been there at the F1C flyoff at the finals and having
listened to F1C sportsmen discuss engine run timing we understand your motivation.
Unfortunately the two people in the USA with the most hands on experience with
Free Flight micro avionics - Ken and me are a little focused on getting ready for
Odessa, [ has to prove something, seeing we both eat our own
dog food, as they say..] - make us a proposal !]
Brokenspar-you were lucky!! We have to row ourselves across in a
Found at the Finals/Sierra Cup
Lost and Found
The Atomic Clock (George, I'll save that for you)
Binoculars on a tripod (ID the make and claim your binos)
Larry Norval's scales (Larry, I assume you will claim those)
two pair of glassed, one black rim, one gold rim (the gold's may be prescription)
a red box with what appears to be a timer and temperature meter (the red box
gives it away)
A blue tarp (still at the filed and on it's way to Buttonwillow)
Team radios, available for the next team manager to take to Ukraine
Babenko's third place trophy at Sierra Cup
Biedron's 2nd place trophy at Sierra Cup
Probably more, haven't completely unpacked.
Mike McKeever (916) 967-8476
Biggles on fire
This is somewhat provoked by Martin's note regarding the finals.
Feel free to flame.
It strikes me that...
An event where five days are required
In the middle of the week
Often held at the same site
Is designed to preclude...
Those with school age children from participating
Those with kids in sports programs from participating
Those from further reaches of the country from participating
Those who find it hard to justify to the family "this is our
family vacation" from participating.
Are people really shocked at the age of finals participants?
The smaller number of finals participants?
It seems as if this is by design?
Keep it moving throughout the country
Hold it over 2 days. Make it tough like the 14 rounder
Do it in late June or July or Christmas break if it is too hot.
In place of processing all models, process the winners. If the
models are not
legit, dq the flyer and move up the next highest placer.
The goal should be to encourage participation not discourage it.
Like I said, feel free to flame.
Gene Ulm, Partner
Public Opinion Strategies, LLC
214 North Fayette St
Alexandria, Virginia 22314
I think the goal of the team selection is to select the team
that will do best in the World Champs. The US probably does better
than every other country except the Ukraine and with any luck
they'll change thier team seelction process to be democratic like ours
and that will help us beat them.The World Champs is a tough contest
and requires a serious commitment. I know people say it's just
another 7 round contest - but that's just not true.
I think the America's Cup events are there to encourage
particpation and raise the standard nation wide.
There are some practical issues such as finding a suitable
site, with more importantly a suitable team to run the event.
For example the El Dorado Dry lake near Henderson NV is a
good site but there are no locals to run an event there.
It's important to have a high standard at every team selection contest,
those that have done the America's Cup Circuit, or the World Cup for that
matter know the standard of execution varies.
Money has been sent transporting people over the east coast of the US looking
for sites. And to my knowledge the only site found is the F1E mentioned
by Jon Davis elsewhere. That seems to be a can of worms !.
Those with longer memories and more experience
than me have flown at other sites around the USA, with experiences much
more miserable and tragic that the recent windy Lost Hills event. [At
one event modellers were killed in a light plance accident looking
for thier models].
Logic tells us that there has to be some prime site, probably
on goverement land somewhere in the USA, there is certainly a lot of
blank space when you fly over it, that has a nearby Day's Inn, Motel 6,
Dennys and even a Jack in a Box ?! A site that no developer wants,
does not have toxic waste and endangered butterfly .. just watch out for
Gene when you're on the campagin trail ! :-)
Biggles to Jimbo - Over
From: "Martyn Cowley"
Reply to Team Selection Proposal:
* The proposal to reorganize the Finals into a "one-day-winner"
event has appeal, but will put even greater dependence upon the
necessity for "perfect" weather throughout the event.
* In summarizing the recent Finals at Lost Hills: the organizers
were faced with trying to implement an essentially fixed schedule,
during a period of highly variable weather conditions that conflicted
directly with such a schedule. These conditions made completing the
event within the allotted time very challenging for 2 out of the 3
events, and it proved only barely possible to complete the Team
Selection under these circumstances, with nothing to spare. The
weather was perhaps unusually bad for this venue at this time of
year, loosing almost the complete first day, curtailing the third
day, and facing a marginal fourth day, with no remaining options
within the allotted time.
* With the universally high performance and consistency of models,
especially F1Cs, and high standard of flying of America's top
sportsmen, very good weather is required for deciding fly offs. In
these conditions, F1Cs are currently likely to be close to the 10
minute max. Such a flight in 6 mph wind will go 1 mile, in 12 mph
wind 2 miles, and allowing for a typical wind gradient at higher
altitudes, even greater distances can result. Within the permitted
FAI limit such flights could certainly go over 3 miles. I have
personally timed several flights between 20 and 40 minutes during the
Black Sheep $1,000 Shoot Out at Taft, where the single winning
flights over the years were typically around 60 minutes. One
particular flight I timed to a visible landing, which I then
retrieved and later verified at exactly 3 miles. However, I realize
that timing such flights demands excellent quality binocular / tripod
equipment, really good (young) eyesight and clear visibility
conditions. Without these conditions, we are all facing an
increasingly difficult task to accurately record flight scores, as
required by the current rules format.
* Consider the present format at the recent Finals, which required 9
hours and 10 minutes of continuous flying activity, 7 early and late
rounds (30 minutes plus 10 minutes x 2), starting at 7:30 am (30
minutes after sunrise) and ending at 4:40 pm. And even this schedule
did not allow adequate remaining daylight for the 4 fly-offs (2 per
each of the two events flown on Day 3) to be completed 30 minutes
before sunset (two early fly offs at 4:40 to 5:00 and 5:50 to 6:00
pm, but only one late fly off 5:20 to 5:30 pm). There is literally
no room for any down time due to wind shifts, or retrieving delays.
* A one-day-winner 7 round contest, would be even more highly
dependent upon good weather throughout the day to stay on schedule,
because it can be anticipated that even more flyers are likely to max
out, in A, B and C, than over the present 2 day, 14 rounds format.
Hence holding both 5 minute and 7 minute fly-offs, will be virtually
essential to achieving a result (witness Mike Thompson's Sierra Cup
fly off, 2 days later at sunset, recording 9:53 with an F1H !) and so
final 10 minute fly-offs on the fourth day would almost certainly be
necessary. Scheduling 7 rounds plus 4 fly-offs (2 per each of the
two events flown) on each of 3 days, is not possible within the
available daylight, unless the event is scheduled earlier in the
year, or further North, during the longer days.
* With barely enough daylight to hold the event in CA in October,
one solution to reduce the schedule would be to reduce round times to
only 20 minutes flying (which is quite representative of a 3 man
Team, flying in a 1 hour round at the World Champs). This would
permit two, 20 minute rounds (early and late) plus two 10 minutes
break times per one hour round. With 7 rounds running from 7:30 am
and ending at 2:30 pm, which would then permit the 4 daily fly-offs
to begin at a reasonable 4:00 to 4:10 pm (early), 4:30 to 4:40 pm
(late) and 5:00 to 5:10 pm (early) and 5:30 to 5:40 pm (late). This
schedule then allows for a total of up to 1 hour 50 minutes of
cumulative delays throughout the day, before the sunset cut-off, to
get all the flights in, again assuming the weather is reasonably
* But even then, we could still be facing up to six different 10
minute fly offs on the morning / evening of Day 4 ! Six fly offs may
be required, because some flyers could have reached both of their 2
Day's fly offs, which would warrant 2 attempts at winning a 10 minute
round fly off, versus others who may have only reached one 10 minute
round fly off. The prospect of up to six 10 minute fly offs becomes
harder to schedule, without risking lift conditions later in the day,
and to fly A, B and C on the same day, also raises potential
timekeeper shortages, unless those competing can also return quickly
to help time others immediately after their own flights, and / or to
re-fly the same model in their second 10 minute fly off !
* Also, what would be the minimum number of rounds required to be
flown on a single day, if the weather was bad, to constitute a result
- 6 rounds, 5 rounds or less, plus fly offs ? Consider Day 1 this
year: too windy to start on time, and only 2 rounds flown. Would
this go to a fly off to decide a winner (with 21 in F1B and 22 in F1C
still remaining). Or would such Day 1 scores be thrown away, or
added to a Day 2 (or Day 3) score as a single-chance, 9 round event ?
And what is the fall back schedule if Days or rounds are lost to
un-flyable weather, or wind shifts require further delays to move the
launching line ?
* It would be interesting to hear the views of other participants at
the Finals, while these ideas are still fresh from the event.