SEN 822 August 20 2003
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News and Reports 2003
SCAT Electronic News 20 August 2003 issue 822
Table of Contents
=================
SGMA Sacramento 2003 - Davis et al
[H/C]LG C-B-C Fuzz - SweepetteLee
NFFS-sponsored AMA-USOC Hi-point Category Championships - Perkins
Mark Drela on discus launched gliders for FF - Much Drela, Little SkyKieng
RE Discus HLG - Murphy
AmpCup History - Parker and the Alien
Plans - and Hungary F1B - Brooks
"Watch your time card" - Secor
DLG...discus launched gliders - Skykieng
T-tails/High tails on F1A's again - Helmick
DT Timers for HLG
Canada Cup - Farkas
Trackers - Ackery
SGMA Sacramento 2003
=====================
SGMA COMBO CONTEST
September 14, 2003
8:00 am to 3:00 pm
Sacramento, California
Gold cup National Cup Contest Silver Cup
Location: Waegell Field ( 1/2 mile north of Jackson Road on
Sunrise Blvd.)
Entry Fee: $10.00 first event.
$5.00 all others.
One time $25.00 entry will cover unlimited
Entry. Junior - $1.00 per event.
Juniors are separate in each class
EVENTS: AMA
Old Timer RC Assist 1/2A Gas
1/2A Texaco A Gas
Texaco B Gas
Antique Combined C Gas
A Limited Engine Run Combined D Gas
B Limited Engine Run Combined Mulvihill
C Limited Engine Run Combined P-30
05 Electric Limited engine Run F1G first round 9:00am
Ohlsson Ignition Side Port F1H first round 9:00am
Brown Jr. Limited Engine Run F1J first round 9:00am
Hand Launch Glider Hand Held Catapult Glider
Moffett Nostalgia Gas
1/2A A
B C
Early 1/2A
F1A, B, C combined. Some Flyers may need time
CD Bill Davis Phone 916-421-8901 This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Loren Schmidt Phone 916-684-2265
Inky Davis and friends will serve lunch
Lunch will be served for each contestant from 12:00 noon to 1:00
pm. Each contestant will be provided a hot dog w/ salad, beans,
chips and soda. Non-contestants may purchase lunch for $5.00 each
Soda and snacks may be purchased throughout the day.
[H/C]LG C-B-C Fuzz
===================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Bruce,
I use the carbon-sided balsa process Stan showed me, which he used on IHLGs.
As follows: med wt 1/8th balsa sheet[grain optional]sanded on both sides,
natch. I have used 3/32nd sheet OK too. But all are parallel nowadays.
I adhere to the K.I.S.S. Principle on this and most design matters.
Cut it about 2-3" by fuselage length plus some, say 20" maybe.
You should get several bodies from this size piece, if you organize it some.
Cut 2 pcs of .1mm carbon sheet[CST, BMP, etc]same size.
Do a flat sandwich layup:c-b-c using med CA dotted all over the balsa.
Do one piece of carbon at a time, cure, then repeat for other carbon side.
I use plate glass, with release paper to prevent the CA from sticking to it.
I do the other side same way, then weigh it down with another plate glass,
also with release paper against it.
After curing, cut bodies out oversize with a knife or diamond slitter if
available. Knifes work fine.
Test bend each blank for full adhesion.
Use thin CA if separation/buckling occurs, then SAND to finished body size.
After attaching the surfaces to the body, as a final touch, go over the
edges of the body with thin CA.
There, that is the whole shmear.
Good luck,
Lee
> [Original Message]
> From: Kimball, Bruce T
> To:
> Date: 8/18/03 10:13:40 AM
> Subject: RE: Heading north
>
> Thanks Lee, on your models what is your technique for the fuselages. I
notice that you had carbon on both sides but don't remember if you tapered
the thickness down to the rear of the fuselage and are you doing a sheet of
wood and then cutting out the profiles or are you doing each fuse
individually. Thanks for being you. See you on Saturday
>
> > Bruce Kimball
> > 655-3093 MS. !W-76
> >
>
NFFS-sponsored AMA-USOC Hi-point Category Championships
=======================================================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
SCAT users:
See the NFFS Web site www.freeflight.org/ for results of the 2003 Nats
NFFS-sponsored AMA-USOC Hi-point Category Championships.
Congratulations to the Champions!
Bob Perkins
Mark Drela on discus launched gliders for FF
============================================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
I asked Mark Drela for his take on FF DLG
The professor kindly obliged
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Drela"
To: "Bill Gieskieng"
Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: DLG...discus launched gliders for FF
>
> The benefits of DL strongly depend on the span.
> The max legal span is 1.5m, and this seems to be
> close to the ideal. I think for a 24" span there
> won't be much altitude difference between DL
> and a conventional javelin launch (JL) assuming
> a strong JL thrower. But a weak thrower will see
> an advantage with DL down to quite small spans.
> BTW, what's wrong with making a big FFHLG?
> I know that indoor HLG has a 100 in^2 limit,
> but there seems to be no such restriction for
> outdoor HLG.
>
> Besides the very large launch height gain, two practical
> advantages of DL have become apparent in RCHLG:
>
> 1) The dependence on the flyer's physique and strength has diminished.
> With JL, the launch heights for 90% of the flyer pool varied from
> 35' to 80' -- more than a factor of 2. Now they vary from maybe
> 110' to 150' -- much closer percentagewise. Results depend more
> on reading air and piloting skill, rather than a huge launch.
> The latter is still important, but much less than it used to be.
>
> 2) The stress on the body has gone from severe to practically nil.
> One can now do a hundred hard launches in one day with no ill effects.
> A number of people who quit RCHLG for physical reasons have re-entered it
> when DL came on the scene.
>
> DL for FFHLG is tough, but I think it can be handled. You want
> an unusually long tail arm for good yaw damping and spiral dive
> resistance. The kite carbon booms will probably be essential
> to take the stress. The pitch trim conflicts between launch,
> climbout, rollout, and glide might be solved with a suitable
> combination of tail tilt, aeroelastics, and maybe a hinged
> elevator actuated by high airspeed.
>
> If this works, the 2 minute max may need to be increased.
> An RCHLG with a good launch can easily exceed 2:00 in dead air.
RE Discus HLG
================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
I attended a free flight contest in Japan this February and observed several fl
yers competiting in HLG using the discus launch.
I am sorry that I did not have a video camera to record this but the models loo
ked to be "normal". The model was held by the wing tip and the flyer made one
rotation to launch the model. The flight path was right climb with left glide.
Jerry Murphy, AMA 917
Magnificent Mountain Men Club
9 Via Escondido Valle
Manitou Springs, CO 80829
AmpCup History
===============
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
The Alien made a suggestion a couple months back and with the help of Alan Pete
rson, NFFs web master, the old AmCup scores from 1992 thru 2002 have been post
ed (PDF format). The provisional start year, 1989 and 1990 andf 1990 were done
on paper by the father of thr AmCup, Al Hotard and so hard copies of the NFFs d
igest will have to be used for those years.
Jim Parker
Plans - and Hungary F1B
========================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Where can I get a plan for the Dream Weaver and the Lucky Lindy?
"Disaffected with F1B" Brooks
ps. I threw the box on the shop floor when I got back from Hungary. Very
little worked right there, and this morning went out again, and , you
guessed it, everything was right on the money. AAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!
I've only been to six champs so my sample is somewhat limited, but in
my opinion it was the worst champs I've been in. The field was bisected
by a wide canal with only one bridge and every chase in that direction
became a marathon. No lunch breaks, and no way to get food or water to
the chasers if your team had limited resources. I gave the follow-up
contest a pass as I could not imagine chasing on that field if the wind
blew in the direction of the canal. Got another good look at the Alps
instead, a much better deal.
A much more important concern than my own personal discomfort was
the way the F1B flyoff was run. When they got to the 9 minute round it
was clear it was going to be a timekeeper's round. Wiith the wind and the
light nobody was going to see the model for the max. I stood behind the
remaining Canadian and observed that he had three timers sitting in
plastic chairs balancing rather ineffective looking bino's on their knees,
and one timer with tripod mounted bino's. Next to him was the eventual
winner with a full compliment of timers all sporting tripod mounted
binos--including the biggest pair I've ever seen--provided by AA.
Now, as it turned out, Horak, the Canadian was out of the running with a
stall on the transition, but if he'd had his usual climb he'd have been
off into the gloom with 3 pairs of shaky knees up against a full compliment
of tripods. A snow ball you-know=3D-where would have a better chance.
T'aint fair lads!!!!!!
"Watch your time card"
=====================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
I agree with Ken this is way to harsh a penalty especially for a Junior !
Give'm a break...aren't we trying to promote this hobby to juniors?
DLG...discus launched gliders
=============================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
> Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
>
> Has anyone worked with discus launch for HLG? It seems to work out well
> with RC gliders.
> Dennis Kargol
I didn't think that it was possible to discus launch a normal Free Flight
HLG because of its light weight, small fin, generous dihedral and a more
rearward c.g. all of which augers well for tumbling rather than zooming.
It seems I was overly pessimistic.
Jerry Murphy, our jovial, and well traveled president of Colorado's MMM
reported that in Japan he saw several flyers using the technique to good
effect by using what appeared to be normal HLGs. As I understand it the
gliders got about the usual height on launch.
However that may be, the discus style is far better suited to much
larger-spanned and heavier gliders that can really translate the powerful
windup and extra leverage the style provides into extra velocity. The 2
meter wingspan and weight of the R.C. DLGs seem a near perfect match up with
physically able flyers that can avoid tripping over their own feet.
Billous Skyslinger
---
T-tails/High tails on F1A's again
=================================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
My comments on T-tail and high-tail (slanted boom) F1A's still stands...they si
nk much worse in CT mode. Jim Walters and some others with similar layouts alwa
ys used a stab kicker (VIT) for CT, which in those days made the zoom less than
desireable. What worked well for good ol' A-2 Nordic (straight tow) didn't wo
rk during the early days of CT. On the other hand, with the servo actuated stab
alizer cycling the stab to CT, ST, Zoom, Glide and DT positions, I guess all t
hat really doesn't matter a lot anymore. But I'd still put the stab a couple o
f inches below the wing & wing at +3. JMHO.
I was hoping to make it to Albany next weekend, as we have been working 3 day
weeks (24 hrs). Unfortunately, our crackerjack management had to choose the
next two weeks to get some machine work into the shop, so I'm stuck in the salt
mine. Thermals, Steve
DT Timers for HLG
=================
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
It has been many years since I flew HLG. I have used burning fuse and sil=
ly putty dt timers. What's the latest?
There used to be a wind-up spring motor from a toy that guys were using,.=
...TOMY? Are they still available? If so, where? Or is there something si=
milar on the market now?
Out of touch and lost in Orange County.
Canada Cup
==========
Author : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Canada Cup 2003
World Cup and America Cup Contest at Base Borden, Ontario.
Dates: August 30th.-31st. and September 1st. 2003
Categories: F1A-F1B-F1C-F1G-F1H-F1J
Schedule:
August 30th. 2003 F1G-F1H-F1J
Five two minutes rounds starting at 9.00AM
Flyoff: August 31st. 2003 at 18.00PM
Entry fee: $15.00 CAD/ Event
Late Entries: $25.00 CAD
August 30th. 2003 F1A-F1B-F1C
Fourteen three minutes rounds starting at 15.00PM
Weather permitting! Rounds 5th. and 6th. Max are: F1A 240 sec. F1B 300 =
sec. F1C 300 sec
Flyoff: August 31st. 2003 at 19.00PM
Entry fee: $25.00 CAD / Event
Late Entries: $40.00 CAD
Banquet: August 31st. 21.00PM
September 1st. will be used as a reserve day.
Current FAI Sporting Codes Apply
All registrations must be received by August 15th.2003 or Late Entry
charges will apply. Foreign entries may pay on the field. Maps to the
field are available on request.
Send registrations to:
Leslie Farkas
21 Misty Moor Drive
Richmond Hill, Ontario
L4C 6P9
Fax: (905) 886-3025
E-mail: This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
Trackers
========
Sender : This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it.
People may be interested in the website for Sirtrack,
this is a New Zealand company that makes a range of animal
tracking devices.
http://sirtrack.landcareresearch.co.nz/index.asp
this provides comprehensive information on their products.
I noticed this after a story in the newspaper today,
I have no experiance with their equipment, and do not know
if they are suitable for FF models.
regards
David Ackery
New Zealand
................
Roger Morrell
